Not yet but stay tuned on this. Serious conversations between colleges and USL & MLS are possibly happening soon. Lots of speculation about this very point recently.
Interesting. I’m English so don’t have 100% understanding of how the system works over there but if you’re looking at easy wins in creating a pyramid system, using the University Teams (maybe 50/50 split in ownership) and the facilities they have could create a decent ‘State Championship’ across the country, that could be below a West and East Conference housing USL L1 and L2 teams that have facilities fitting for professional teams. Just a thought
Excellent presentation. I've often had similar thoughts about how this could work. You see it in England with the National League North/South (tier 6) being split up geographically. It just makes sense from a cost perspective and fan engagement perspective. This would also allow the cost of entry for new clubs to be much easier at the USL1 & 2 levels
This is a sound proposal, very well thought out! I concur with your philosophy of a 2 pyramid system! This is exactly how I would scaffold a pyramid for local to regional play.
The elephant in the room is that the PLS stands in direct opposition to a merit based system. Unless they are changed, I cannot see Pro/Rel working on merit.
However, that being said, there is a potential loophole in the PLS that could give USL the ability to structure a pyramid, as you described, and still make the qualifications that the PLS require.
There is ZERO definition in the PLS for what defines a "season" and this could be a key loophole if the PLS remain in place! Since the PLS requires there to be a champion decided within the Division 1 standards, USL only needs to hold a separate cup competition held between the teams that meet the PLS requirements for Division 1. Then, offer a merit-based system with Pro/Rel as described as an alternate competition!
I feel like the Jägermeister cup is the beta test for such a system. If I were them, I would make the first season a locally regionalized (8 Divisions as you suggested) competition as a "Play-In" season to establish the leagues starting on merit. 1st / 2nd earn Premier, 3rd / 4th the Championship and so on.
Great article! The USL needs to take this into consideration!
That's why I said USL should ignore the current PLS and come up with their own criteria, such as the licensing system I laid out in the last article. If USL, or a collaboration of owners, laid out their own criteria for professional clubs, I'd bet USSF would go along with it.
Historically, America had separate professional leagues in the NFL/AFL, NBA/ABA, and National League/American League.
So we should agree that our mature professional leagues have all been through. However, at some point, a merger between the two major professional leagues occurred. While some clubs did not survive due to overlap, they eventually reached a point where the merger made sense, either to increase the wealth of all owners or as a necessary step forward for the league.
What I don’t understand is why either league (MLS or USL) are comfortable doubling down on maintaining separate Division I leagues and instead of merging the pyramid (and regions if necessary) and moved forward with that.
Instead of continuing to have separate Division I leagues, we could select 10 USL Championship teams that are willing to invest in competing with MLS. We could then define the second tier as the remaining USL Championship teams and the superior USL League One teams, and the third tier as the pro next level, weaker USL League One teams, and so on. We could establish regions, pro/rel rules, and then get on with it. The fourth tier could include NPSL USL 2 and UPSL.
Once we have a unified structure, we could allocate the revenue from parachute payments and other sources according to a clear and understandable framework. Each owner would have all the incentive to either exit the business or invest in climbing the pyramid.
It's about money and control. MLS seems to want to control the whole sport of soccer in the US. USL doesn't have money to compete with them head-to-head. The best option is to change the narrative. If USL brought everyone to the table, you'd get your unified dual pyramid. Soccer thrives when it's localized. But it's a global sport. What works for the other sports leagues won't work for soccer because the US doesn't have the monopoly on soccer talent. As far as allocating places in the pyramid, the current conference structure has it laid out. West Conference MLS/ USLC make up West Div1/2. The opposite for the East. Regionalize from there with the remaining leagues/clubs.
You should emphasize Pro/ Rel a little bit more, Jason! Soccer purists everywhere would clamor for this, as it aligns with the rest of the world AND drives innovation & banishes complacency. The Pro/ Rel rules could be flexible and forgiving, such as if you have an excellent soccer-specific stadium which is consistently filled with enthusiastic fans, your club could be spared from instant relegation (such as due to a run of injuries or other bad luck)
More importantly, your otherwise excellent article has neglected to mention the cross-fertilization and buoyancy that having a complementary women's side can give to the men's side. Charlotte is a vivid example of this, with the Ascent outdrawing the men's Independence by 3 to 1.
Sadly I'm not in NC, but have followed the Ascent story with great interest! Let's hope the Ascent helps to ensure that the Independence continues to grow....
Speaking of being an Ascent STH, how much cross-promotion have you seen between the men's and women's sides? Do you get emails or promotional snail mail advertising the men's games occasionally? Both teams are owned by the same owner (the guy that founded Nucor), so that cross-promotion would seem to be a "no-brainer"!
There is no cross-promotion. You wouldn't even know the other team exists. And there is a very noticeable difference in the crowds for CLTFC and Independence/Ascent. The atmosphere is totally different also. You constantly hear about CLTFC; Independence/Ascent, not so much. It seems that most of the crowd makeup for Independence/Ascent comes from the families of their youth teams.
The Ascent routinely draw 5K fans so it has to be far more than families and friends. And hopefully in one generation, the draw for Ascent will match that of any MLS side. I mean, the MLS has had a 20 year head start and untold $$ millions support from USSF (via sacrificing SUM proceeds), so the comparison is not fair at this early stage of the USLSL
Ascent absolutely does not draw any where close to 5K fans per game, though they may distribute 5K tickets. The only time they've come close to that number was the first home game this season where they had 10K, a sellout. Since then, 2500 would be generous. You can pull up an old game on Peacock and see the low attendance. American Legion holds 10K. At best, I'd say they average 1500.
Charlotte Independence has 12K youth in their leagues and they give away free tickets to the families. That explained the number of Independence kits I saw at the Ascent games.
Great work, George, you’ve created a great vision for soccer in the U.S. My concern is having USL (or MLS or any single “league”) drive the bus.
The mergers of other American sports (except baseball) weren’t done for the good of the game; one major league “won” and one or more others lost; teams folded and owners lost millions.
I think U.S. Soccer would have to bring MLS and USL together and say, “Here’s how this is going to work: in ‘x’ years all professional soccer will be organized this way. Get ready.”
Given how traditionally complacent and compromised our federation has been, I don’t know how to make that happen.
Has there ever been an idea to lean into the University teams to prop up a North American pyramid?
Not yet but stay tuned on this. Serious conversations between colleges and USL & MLS are possibly happening soon. Lots of speculation about this very point recently.
Interesting. I’m English so don’t have 100% understanding of how the system works over there but if you’re looking at easy wins in creating a pyramid system, using the University Teams (maybe 50/50 split in ownership) and the facilities they have could create a decent ‘State Championship’ across the country, that could be below a West and East Conference housing USL L1 and L2 teams that have facilities fitting for professional teams. Just a thought
Excellent presentation. I've often had similar thoughts about how this could work. You see it in England with the National League North/South (tier 6) being split up geographically. It just makes sense from a cost perspective and fan engagement perspective. This would also allow the cost of entry for new clubs to be much easier at the USL1 & 2 levels
This is a sound proposal, very well thought out! I concur with your philosophy of a 2 pyramid system! This is exactly how I would scaffold a pyramid for local to regional play.
The elephant in the room is that the PLS stands in direct opposition to a merit based system. Unless they are changed, I cannot see Pro/Rel working on merit.
However, that being said, there is a potential loophole in the PLS that could give USL the ability to structure a pyramid, as you described, and still make the qualifications that the PLS require.
There is ZERO definition in the PLS for what defines a "season" and this could be a key loophole if the PLS remain in place! Since the PLS requires there to be a champion decided within the Division 1 standards, USL only needs to hold a separate cup competition held between the teams that meet the PLS requirements for Division 1. Then, offer a merit-based system with Pro/Rel as described as an alternate competition!
I feel like the Jägermeister cup is the beta test for such a system. If I were them, I would make the first season a locally regionalized (8 Divisions as you suggested) competition as a "Play-In" season to establish the leagues starting on merit. 1st / 2nd earn Premier, 3rd / 4th the Championship and so on.
Great article! The USL needs to take this into consideration!
That's why I said USL should ignore the current PLS and come up with their own criteria, such as the licensing system I laid out in the last article. If USL, or a collaboration of owners, laid out their own criteria for professional clubs, I'd bet USSF would go along with it.
Historically, America had separate professional leagues in the NFL/AFL, NBA/ABA, and National League/American League.
So we should agree that our mature professional leagues have all been through. However, at some point, a merger between the two major professional leagues occurred. While some clubs did not survive due to overlap, they eventually reached a point where the merger made sense, either to increase the wealth of all owners or as a necessary step forward for the league.
What I don’t understand is why either league (MLS or USL) are comfortable doubling down on maintaining separate Division I leagues and instead of merging the pyramid (and regions if necessary) and moved forward with that.
Instead of continuing to have separate Division I leagues, we could select 10 USL Championship teams that are willing to invest in competing with MLS. We could then define the second tier as the remaining USL Championship teams and the superior USL League One teams, and the third tier as the pro next level, weaker USL League One teams, and so on. We could establish regions, pro/rel rules, and then get on with it. The fourth tier could include NPSL USL 2 and UPSL.
Once we have a unified structure, we could allocate the revenue from parachute payments and other sources according to a clear and understandable framework. Each owner would have all the incentive to either exit the business or invest in climbing the pyramid.
It's about money and control. MLS seems to want to control the whole sport of soccer in the US. USL doesn't have money to compete with them head-to-head. The best option is to change the narrative. If USL brought everyone to the table, you'd get your unified dual pyramid. Soccer thrives when it's localized. But it's a global sport. What works for the other sports leagues won't work for soccer because the US doesn't have the monopoly on soccer talent. As far as allocating places in the pyramid, the current conference structure has it laid out. West Conference MLS/ USLC make up West Div1/2. The opposite for the East. Regionalize from there with the remaining leagues/clubs.
You should emphasize Pro/ Rel a little bit more, Jason! Soccer purists everywhere would clamor for this, as it aligns with the rest of the world AND drives innovation & banishes complacency. The Pro/ Rel rules could be flexible and forgiving, such as if you have an excellent soccer-specific stadium which is consistently filled with enthusiastic fans, your club could be spared from instant relegation (such as due to a run of injuries or other bad luck)
More importantly, your otherwise excellent article has neglected to mention the cross-fertilization and buoyancy that having a complementary women's side can give to the men's side. Charlotte is a vivid example of this, with the Ascent outdrawing the men's Independence by 3 to 1.
In my book, I actually mention this could be used with the women's leagues also. Are you in the Charlotte area? I'm an Ascent STH
Sadly I'm not in NC, but have followed the Ascent story with great interest! Let's hope the Ascent helps to ensure that the Independence continues to grow....
Speaking of being an Ascent STH, how much cross-promotion have you seen between the men's and women's sides? Do you get emails or promotional snail mail advertising the men's games occasionally? Both teams are owned by the same owner (the guy that founded Nucor), so that cross-promotion would seem to be a "no-brainer"!
There is no cross-promotion. You wouldn't even know the other team exists. And there is a very noticeable difference in the crowds for CLTFC and Independence/Ascent. The atmosphere is totally different also. You constantly hear about CLTFC; Independence/Ascent, not so much. It seems that most of the crowd makeup for Independence/Ascent comes from the families of their youth teams.
The Ascent routinely draw 5K fans so it has to be far more than families and friends. And hopefully in one generation, the draw for Ascent will match that of any MLS side. I mean, the MLS has had a 20 year head start and untold $$ millions support from USSF (via sacrificing SUM proceeds), so the comparison is not fair at this early stage of the USLSL
Ascent absolutely does not draw any where close to 5K fans per game, though they may distribute 5K tickets. The only time they've come close to that number was the first home game this season where they had 10K, a sellout. Since then, 2500 would be generous. You can pull up an old game on Peacock and see the low attendance. American Legion holds 10K. At best, I'd say they average 1500.
Charlotte Independence has 12K youth in their leagues and they give away free tickets to the families. That explained the number of Independence kits I saw at the Ascent games.
Great work, George, you’ve created a great vision for soccer in the U.S. My concern is having USL (or MLS or any single “league”) drive the bus.
The mergers of other American sports (except baseball) weren’t done for the good of the game; one major league “won” and one or more others lost; teams folded and owners lost millions.
I think U.S. Soccer would have to bring MLS and USL together and say, “Here’s how this is going to work: in ‘x’ years all professional soccer will be organized this way. Get ready.”
Given how traditionally complacent and compromised our federation has been, I don’t know how to make that happen.